The Date Of The Mahabharata War

Jun 28 2003  | Views 24232 |  Comments  (31)
One may question the reliability of the earlier parts of this list since the average span of reign for the pre-Nanda kings is more than twice as much for the post-Nanda ones. The explanation appears to be that it was during the imperial Maurya age that comprehensive king-lists were made and, consequently, only the better-known names of the earlier period were included. The centennial counting system, named after the ... Expand

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  siargi posted 2 yrs ago

An excellent work of research on the  historical epic.

While both ramayana and the Mahabharatha are considered as epics still, unless there  was some historical validity in them, they would not have  been penned by poets.
I have been also following up on the dating of these, and sometime back, I found on the web, a report of a fortress-temple city dicovered in the depths off the Gujarat coast. Dr. S.R.Rao, the doyen of marine archeologists who undertook this expedition, has said, in no uncertain terms, that this was  t5he Dwaraka of Sri Krishna that went down and has dated it more than 8000 years back.
With this where do we stand in terms of dating the Mahabharatha? And the Ramayana which took place much earlier should also be definitely older.

I  am confused  and would like some clarifications on this.


C.R.Gopalakrishna



  amitrawat09 posted 2 yrs ago

i, read the article on age of mahabharata war ,its brilliant so can you also postulate the date of ramayana war



  balu anand posted 2 yrs ago

The details given by you are  examined astronomically already by  Dr. Vartak  and his conclusion is  around 5150  bc. I would however wish that you had written more about the stupid aryan invasion theory



  Surin Usgaonkar posted 3 yrs ago

I quote from the " Scientific dating of Mahabharata War" by Dr P V Vartak . From his original book called "Swayambhu" in Marathi

Quote: "All the twelve planets confirm their said positions on 16th October 5561 years B.C. along with two Amavasyas, two eclipses, Kshaya Paksha and a Comet. Thus, in all 18 mathematical positions fix the same date. Therefore, we have to accept this date of the Mahabharat War, if we want to be scientific. Please note that all the twelve planets will come in the same positions again only after 2229 crores of years. That means it will never happen again in the life of our earth, because life of the earth is only 400 crores of years. So the date of the Mahabharat War is pin-pointed as 16th October 5561 B.C." Unquote.
Among the many theories the reasoning of this appeals to me the most .
Detail analytical report (in English) is avalable on

http://www.fortunecity.com/rivendell/ultima/419/the_scientific_dating_of_the_mahabharat_war.htm

I would like the views of the author on the arguments therein

Surin Usgaonkar, Mumbai



  Subhash Kak posted 5 yrs ago

For a more comprehensive treatment of the problem of the date of the Mahabharata War, see this paper: www.ece.lsu.edu/kak/MahabharataII.pdf



  Raj Mohanka posted 5 yrs ago

Dr. Kak, Good article. I am interested in a few points you made: 1) Please e-mail me your source regarding the 3000 B.C.E. archaeological evidence at Kurukshetra. 2) Please e-mail me any articles supporting the thesis that the Sarasvati River ceased to be seagoing (i.e., reaching the ocean) by 3000 B.C.E. 3) Please e-mail me the list (Guru-Parampara) of 60 teachers mentioned in the Brihadaranyaka Upanishad. 4) Regarding the Puranic Kings' Lists and their Regnal periods, I have used these lists to build my Royal Chronology India timeline (downloadable from NewDharma.org), but I have used shorter Regnal periods (20-25 years). This results in a timeframe for the Mahabharat War around 1300 B.C.E. Changing the regnal period to a uniform 25 years could push this date back to 1500 B.C.E., but without adding additional Kings, there is no way to push the date back to 1900 B.C.E. and certainly not 3000 B.C.E. - Raj Mohanka Visit: http://www.NewDharma.org to: - Download 'The Royal Chronology of India' (a generational timeline of Indian history from 7000 B.C.E. to the present spanning over 300 generations) - click on 'Royal Chronology' in the left navigation bar at the website.



  paradoxically posted 5 yrs ago

i think all the scholars and laymen on this board have discounted the Aryan Invasion theory completely. However we must note that taking 3012B.C as the date for Mahabharata war will mean that the composition of Rigveda must have started at least by 4000 B.C. This theory is problematic as domestication of Horses (which find prominent mention in the text) began in the steppes only in 3500 B.C.



  BoredFoo posted 5 yrs ago

Thank you Mr. Kak for the excellent article. I am impressed by an equally eduated readers and their postings. Couple of things struck me that i would like to throw in to the discussion. 1) One of the readers pointed to a study using the NASA software to determine the two eclipses with in 13 days phenom. But the time period taken in to consideration was from around 3500BCE or so to about 500AD i believe. But an alternative analysis suggested by Dr. P.V.Vartak identified Mahabarat war to around 5561BCE. It would be nice to extend the NASA analysis to include a broader time period say about from 6000BC or earlier to validate Mr. Vartak's analysis. I myself found Mr. Vartak's analysis interesting, but found there were assumptions made, that were disputed in other analysis. 2) A general assumption is that Ramayan era is before Mahabarat era, and it is believed that rama travelled from ayodhya down south all the way to lanka. In the process there might have been communities and probable civilizations that he came across on his way to lanka. But most of the mahabart references are centered around northern part of india extending only up to vindya/satpura ranges of madhyapradesh. There were not many references to anything from southern part of india. Are there any known archeological findings in southern india that date back to 3500BC and earlier related to ramayan/mahabarat etc? Were there any noted excavations? There were some news paper reports about some findings dating back to 8000BC. Any one know more about that? Bored and curious.



  Shashi K Gadia posted 5 yrs ago

This is related to posting #9 by Kshatra Dharma. As always, Subhash Kak provides us with an insightful article on the date of the Mahabharata. This date is intertwined with the start of Kaliyuga. If one is settled so is the other. There are two very important anchor points in Indian history: (1) The starting date of Kaliyuga, and (2) 324 BCE, which is commonly believed to be the date of Chandragupta Maurya’s coronation. It seems that in the Hindu establishment, there was a unanimous agreement that Kaliyuga started in 3102 BCE. After having effectively discredited the Aryan Invasion Theory, this date is no longer far fetched. In this article Subhash Kak has also considered this date a possibility. As far as I understand, there was no confusion about the date of Kaliyuga before 1794 CE. This is when 324 BCE, the famous anchor point for Indian history, was postulated in a speech by William Jones, who had founded the Asiatic Society in Calcutta a decade earlier in 1784. I believe Jones’ observation was based upon the account of Megasthenes, who mentions Sandracottus as his contemporary. It is not obvious that Megasthenes described Chandragupta Maurya. For instance, I have seen claims that Megasthenes never used the words “Maurya” to describe his Sandrocottus. He also does not seem to mention Chanakya (= Kautilya = Vishnugupt), which appears to be rather odd, considering gigantic importance of Chanakya. Megasthenes' description of “Sandracottus”, according to some interpretations, seems to point to Samudragupta of the Gupta Dynasty! If one accepts that Megasthenes was referring to Samudragupta, all discrepancies about the starting date of Kaliyuga simply melt away. I understand that the Puranas are considered controversial by some people. But the start of Kaliyuga is considered the single most important and precise anchor point in Hindu scriptures and establishment. How could Hindu scholars mess up an anchor-point in history that is so profoundly important to them? Nobody can accuse Indians to be poor in doing their arithmetic. Also, why would they deliberatively lie about this date? What possible motive would they have to lie about this anchor date by merely 1200 years, a tiny period in their chronology of yugas? On the other hand, dating given by European Indologists, such as Max Mueller and others has fallen out of repute. What is special about William Jones? Maybe the question “Who was the real Sandracottus?” needs to be revisited seriously. For most of us the question seems non-trivial because of our lack of knowledge of primary sources. How do Buddhist and Jain scholars date these events? It may be that the question does have a simple answer. In addition, I find Kak’s argument about catastrophe not very convincing. The start of Kaliyuga or the Mahabharata can be considered instants of time. But the drying of the Saraswati River that took several centuries, although an event of immense importance it is hardly an instant of time. Therefore, it does not seem logical for authors of the Puranas to have used drying up of Saraswati as a reference point in time. Skeptics should note that the issue of the starting date of Kaliyuga is independent of their beliefs about how grand Mahabharata was, weather Krishna was god, and the period of Rama. This anchor point of Indian history is very important and should be studied seriously. Thanks to Subhash Kak for his contribution.



  yajna posted 5 yrs ago

dr.kak, on the topic of four yugas being a latter day corruption, i found this very interesting passage from atharva veda that seems to know of chaturyuga. the verse i'm talking is from book viii, hymn 2 and verse 21 ... | shatam te ayutam hayanaan dve yuge threeni chatvari krunmaha|





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